PC - Endurance Season 5 - Round 1 - Daytona - 02/05/19 | ApexOnlineRacing.com

PC Endurance Season 5 - Round 1 - Daytona - 02/05/19


inkychris

AOR PC GT3 S12 T2 Champion
Dec 9, 2018
134
104
Wasn't able to put in full race distance practice before this so went into the race with a bit of a marathon "last part's a mystery" mentality but overall really pleased to get 2nd. As we are all aware there were plenty of incidents so I count myself lucky that I only really ran wide a couple times and never made any contact the whole race, although the state of my car in the live stream would have suggested otherwise! Watched the whole live stream today to see what else was going on - thanks @Yorkie065 for the great coverage!

I definitely shouldn't have used free practice for my practice as I opted for a pretty high downforce setup which, when near other LMP cars, cost me a lot of time in sector one and with little ability to get a tow on the banking. My average lap time for high and low downforce was very similar in practice so I went high to be more forgiving which I think I may have to thank for the clean race at least. It was probably also why I wasn't able to eke out a 2-stop strategy like my teammate @F4H MaR4uDer - looking good for the constructors ;)

It will be interesting to see how the Porsche fairs against the Audi round the tighter circuits. I'll certainly be doing some lobby/AI practice instead of solo for the rest of the season to see if I can give @Zenvoh and @Jarmo at least a hint of competition! Really sorry that @AndrexUK is leaving, of course you know I'm not alone in saying we really don't want to see you go!

See you all at RBR!
 
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TicklishPicklewickle

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Oct 23, 2016
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I honestly thought looking at the number of signups that I wouldn't stand a chance of getting in for the first round at least
To put it quite simply, this is the sole reason why 9/10 people never show up. As soon as they see the word "reserve" above their name, they just drop all they have and never come back again. It's hella sad because if people were more aware of the slightly different (modified/improved if you will) reserve system we have in this league, we would actually see some of the reserves showing up. But I can't wrap my head around how we are going to get it into people's heads. Then again, I also think that a certain amount of commitment is required for people to bother actually reading the rules and info before they sign up and this is a perfect example that some people just straight up lack that commitment :rolleyes:
 

Royalt

Formula 4 2nd Driver
Feb 4, 2019
111
45
To put it quite simply, this is the sole reason why 9/10 people never show up. As soon as they see the word "reserve" above their name, they just drop all they have and never come back again. It's hella sad because if people were more aware of the slightly different (modified/improved if you will) reserve system we have in this league, we would actually see some of the reserves showing up. But I can't wrap my head around how we are going to get it into people's heads. Then again, I also think that a certain amount of commitment is required for people to bother actually reading the rules and info before they sign up and this is a perfect example that some people just straight up lack that commitment :rolleyes:
I have to agree there, i was a bit down being marked as a reserve but as luck would have it, managed to have a go at round 1. Its like you say, people read reserve and lose interest. What upsets me and maybe a few others is you have all these people signing up but never pitching or participating on the forum yet still get a main spot.
 

igor55

DiRT Coordinator
Staff member
DiRT Coordinator
Aug 7, 2017
865
720
Guys, I really want to apoligise for not being there yesterday. Being 16th reserve I assumed I wouldn't be racing. I raced previously on PS4 and didn't really know there was such a big difference in the rules regarding reserves.
Now that I know this I will definetely be there, and completely be ready to race for the next race.
Again, sorry, only myself to blame. Really didn't expect I had a chance of racing but I'll be ready to race next time :D
 

AndrexUK

2 times PC Project Cars 2 Champion
Staff member
AC Coordinator
May 6, 2015
5,692
5,528
@Smolda
No Worries mate :)
As I said, it was not really just a few things that turned it into a bad night, it was a combination of all things together.
I'm not annoyed with the guy in front spinning out and hitting me, as they have lost control, so it can (and does) happen.
It's just that out of my last 9 races, I've been collected 8 times...

As for the lag incident in the first stint, yeah, I watched my replay, and it was more or less identical to yours.
And this is the 2nd time this has happened to me (last time was in S9 (I think) at Redbull Ring, while in an epic battle with a few guys)
Very odd lag, as it teleport's me back about 50m.
It could have happened at almost ANY other time in the race, and there wouldn't have been a car 50m behind me... but that seams to be my luck just now...
So no blame on you at all for that!
And just because you 'CAN' go 2 wide through that kink, doesn't mean you 'SHOULD'!
2 LMPH's, sure, that would work, but GTE's use the full track at full speed, so the faster car should just be patient imo.

I'll have a think, and we'll see what numbers we have for RBR, but lost a lot of love for pCars just now.
And then to add that I'm really loving ACC right now is not helping me want to drive pCars again...

But fear not, I could never loose any love for someone else when they drive the Aston!
 
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TicklishPicklewickle

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Oct 23, 2016
5,373
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What upsets me and maybe a few others is you have all these people signing up but never pitching or participating on the forum yet still get a main spot.
That's why we have our trusty old no-show system. No-show without informing a coordinator 3 times in the same league, and it's an instant removal and blacklist from the league. We want this to be a league accessible to everyone but in no way do we tolerate uncomitted people holding up main spots for reserves who are actually comitted. We are not afraid of handing out blacklists for these people as I think we can all agree we would rather have 25 fully comitted drivers than 60 drivers where over half of them doesn't even bother to show up
 

Smolda

AOR PC Endurance League S4 GTE Champion
Oct 23, 2017
333
280
And then to add that I'm really loving ACC right now is not helping me want to drive pCars again...
Well, I bought ACC a few months ago, but last time I tried it there were only 2 cars in the game. It looks promising, but I'm so used to Pcars "feeling" that it's gonna take me a while to adjust to a new game. Also, GT3's only? C'mon! :-D And last thing that bothers me is the lack of triple screen support. From what I read on the official forum, implementing it is not one of their priorities o_O I mean, really? Racing sim without triple screen support? But I'm definitely planning to try this game again ...
But fear not, I could never loose any love for someone else when they drive the Aston!
That's good to hear :D I was actually surprised by it's performance. Right now I'm pretty sure it's faster, than the Ford for example .... but that might change next round I suppose :)
 

F4H MaR4uDer

Formula 4 1st Driver
Dec 3, 2017
167
99
Well sorry that @AndrexUK left the championship, after the 4 session where we had our fights that were fun and beautiful, especially that fight in Indianapolis, even after we had that touch because there was a LMP1H in the middle of the battle in braking the 1st curve.

Well the other night in Qualy I did not do a great time because my setup was more for race, I opted for a very low load that gave me speed in the fast zones, and thanks to them and the errors or problems of the other riders I was raised with the 3rd place, it was a nice race, I had several plugs in the chicane where I found several GTE tracing and had to slow down and pass behind them and start accelerating with force and giving all the KERS, in short it is something normal and this It will be like this in the following circuits that will be more twisted, I thank my teammate @inkychris for his excellent result that puts us in front of the team classification table.


Finally I wanted to tell you @AndrexUK that you would give one last chance to the game and the championship and run in RedBull Ring and then you decided your withdrawal or continuity.
 

Louis

Pro Karter
Aug 11, 2017
42
26
going back to what @AndrexUK said about GTE not staying to their lines. there were a few moments where I had issues. at one point I had a GTE squeeze me into the pit wall luckily didn't get damage but almost cost me a battle. Another time I had one leave the inside line open so I took it, whilst alongside I was squeezed off the track. I was lucky in being able to hold the car and recover. I believe the main issue around multi-class racing is people not knowing the rules surrounding their class. if everyone GTE's and LMPH's fully knew what the rules are (which we should) we wouldn't be having these issues.
 

Andrew Harper

Pro Karter
Aug 2, 2018
40
21
people read reserve and lose interest
No, not at all my friend. My only other experience of leagues is on RaceDepartment and SimRacingOnline. RD sometimes operate a policy of banning you if you don't turn up so reserves don't normally see any race action at all during a league. SRO are a lot more relaxed and yes we tend to lose about half the field during each league "season". However they are a very small operation so reserves of any kind are pretty rare anyway.

You could say RD's route is draconian but it works and they keep full grids for each round.

In this case when I saw I was near the very bottom of the reserve list I left it as I assumed that yes there would be no shows, but not expected that many. Usually you tend to get drop outs after the 1st or 2nd round when people have accidents, get fed up, etc. So I'm just surprised it turned out the way it did for round one.

Like I say I'll be there for round two, no problem :)
 

Andrew Harper

Pro Karter
Aug 2, 2018
40
21
Well, I bought ACC a few months ago, but last time I tried it there were only 2 cars in the game. It looks promising, but I'm so used to Pcars "feeling" that it's gonna take me a while to adjust to a new game. Also, GT3's only? C'mon! :-D And last thing that bothers me is the lack of triple screen support. From what I read on the official forum, implementing it is not one of their priorities o_O I mean, really? Racing sim without triple screen support? But I'm definitely planning to try this game again ...
ACC is having an interesting effect on RD I've noticed. The weekly races are attracting sometimes two servers worth of drivers. The negative effect of this is it's reducing racer numbers on RF2, Raceroom, AMS, etc. to only a handful. Like @AndrexUK mentions it's developing a huge following and on some forums it's all people talk about at the moment.

In the developers defense the triple screen support is an issue with the game engine. It's only recently that the UE engine now supports it properly (v4.22 I believe). I think Kartkraft is very nearly there on this (it's just been updated to v4.21) So they can't do anything until the UE engine supports it properly. I would imagine their priority is get the game finished first and then work on triples, VR, etc. afterwards.

So it will probably happen at some point. I suppose the only danger is you will need a Godzilla of a PC to render that amount of pixel real estate. We'll see.
 

SmokingPuppy841

Really Useful Person
Oct 24, 2016
2,230
832
How about instead of "reserve" put the numbers 1-53. This way instead of "reserve" people may say 36 and think "I have a good chance". For the next round, all the drivers who turn up are inverted and all the ones who didn't are.

Eg

Pre-Season
  1. A
  2. B
  3. C
  4. D
  5. E
  6. F
  7. G
  8. H
etc.

At Round One A, C, D, F and H turn up

For Round Two:
  1. H
  2. F
  3. D
  4. C
  5. A
  6. G
  7. E
  8. B

I know this is similar to what happens anyway, but it might encourage more drivers to race when it is visually obvious.

Or, to protect the early Sign-Ups.

If 53 entries and 32 in a lobby, Their are 42 reserves. This means the first 11 Sign-Ups race every week, as well as half the reserves rotating.

Obviously, the reserves not racing can replace the ones racing if availiable. If they turn up and can't race, they are "locked in" to the next round anyway. All those that turn up are rotated, with those that are in the second 21 put in front of those in the first 21.

So if A-H were reserves, using the example above.
The order for Round 2 would be: F,H, A, C, E, G, B.

Again, this pretty much happens anyway, but it makes it more obvious (and as we struggle for a full grid, reserve order rarely matters). Also maybe clauses meaning title contenders aren't forced out of the last round.
 

TicklishPicklewickle

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Oct 23, 2016
5,373
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How about instead of "reserve" put the numbers 1-53. This way instead of "reserve" people may say 36 and think "I have a good chance". For the next round, all the drivers who turn up are inverted and all the ones who didn't are.

Eg

Pre-Season
  1. A
  2. B
  3. C
  4. D
  5. E
  6. F
  7. G
  8. H
etc.

At Round One A, C, D, F and H turn up

For Round Two:
  1. H
  2. F
  3. D
  4. C
  5. A
  6. G
  7. E
  8. B
I know this is similar to what happens anyway, but it might encourage more drivers to race when it is visually obvious.

Or, to protect the early Sign-Ups.

If 53 entries and 32 in a lobby, Their are 42 reserves. This means the first 11 Sign-Ups race every week, as well as half the reserves rotating.

Obviously, the reserves not racing can replace the ones racing if availiable. If they turn up and can't race, they are "locked in" to the next round anyway. All those that turn up are rotated, with those that are in the second 21 put in front of those in the first 21.

So if A-H were reserves, using the example above.
The order for Round 2 would be: F,H, A, C, E, G, B.

Again, this pretty much happens anyway, but it makes it more obvious (and as we struggle for a full grid, reserve order rarely matters). Also maybe clauses meaning title contenders aren't forced out of the last round.
I like your proposal, but I don't think it's the actual system that's the problem here. The core of the problem is that people aren't aware how it works (because a lot of people don't read rules and info before signing up even though that's what they agree to have done upon sign-up). If more people knew how it worked and that you actually get rewarded for just showing up in the first place, I'm sure more people would show up on race night. The tricky thing is just to get it drilled into people's heads which seems to be a much harder task than initially anticipated
 
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Jarmo

Pro Karter
Jan 12, 2019
45
48
It will be interesting to see how the Porsche fairs against the Audi round the tighter circuits. I'll certainly be doing some lobby/AI practice instead of solo for the rest of the season to see if I can give @Zenvoh and @Jarmo at least a hint of competition! Really sorry that @AndrexUK is leaving, of course you know I'm not alone in saying we really don't want to see you go!
I managed to stay out of trouble, not a single major mistake all race. I had a halfspin T4 but no contact what so ever.

My point is, my pace wasn't that great. I was a second off pace to Zenvoh, too bad his game crashed. Despite that, I won because of flow through traffic and no mistakes. And pit strategy, what is that ;) I put full fuel and changed all tyres all stops.

This was my first ever Endurance race and I do apologize to those who suffered a crazy dive bomb and a suprise overtake from my LMP car, I know dalking was one of them. Hopefully I will have my brain with me at RBR.
 

Logan

F1 2nd Driver
Aug 13, 2018
567
313
@Royalt Sorry It has been a very busy past few days for me. Currently in the process of moving, so I haven't had much time to get online. Will try to get them updated this evening if I get the chance.
 
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F4H MaR4uDer

Formula 4 1st Driver
Dec 3, 2017
167
99
@Logan @AndrexUK @SmokingPuppy841
I have an idea to implement a new method to evaluate the pilots, in this way it would be somewhat easier to create championships.

This is similar to the reality, as they do in the WEC, consider the pilots as a pilot Bronze, Silver, Gold or Platinum, that is, every new pilot will be a Bronze pilot until he has completed a championship of the forum and has demonstrated his ability, in this way you can go up to Silver if you show that you are competitive and respect and respect the rules, this would be for all riders whether or not they participated in a championship and there is a record of their times and results.

For example, a Bronze pilot could never participate in a WEC with an LMP1H, but if with an LMP2 or a GTE in class AM (Amater), the Silver pilots could already participate with an LMP1H or in LMP2 if desired and in GTE PRO , this can also be applied in the GT3 league or in a single-seater league. Even so all riders must pass an evaluation race before each championship to see their performance in the race, and if they respect the rules and understand the basic rules of the race. Even so, if you are very fast in the GT3 league, you will have to compete in a more vague class than you can, to go up little by little.
 

AndrexUK

2 times PC Project Cars 2 Champion
Staff member
AC Coordinator
May 6, 2015
5,692
5,528
In an ideal world, that would make sense!
However, when you take the option away of driving the car that someone wants too take, then they are just as likely to not signup at all, as they are to drive the other car that they don't really want too.
And Endurance / Multi-class is a niche part of sim racing on the grand scheme of things.
We need to be getting more drivers in, not putting barriers in the way I'm afraid.

Again, ideal world and all, sounds good!
But not convinced it would work in this reality :(
 

F4H MaR4uDer

Formula 4 1st Driver
Dec 3, 2017
167
99
@AndrexUK It is only to try it 1 sole season and see if this works, and see if the pilots that already exist in the forum welcome it, because for me to let run a rookie driver with an LMP1H is risky since there are damages and they can inadvertently take in a braking to another pilot by means and destroy the race, so in these cases is to create a mode of evaluation and pilot range, so there will be no problems.
 
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AndrexUK

2 times PC Project Cars 2 Champion
Staff member
AC Coordinator
May 6, 2015
5,692
5,528
Well, I think it would only really work properly, if it was going to be used in all the future seasons, as ppl need to complete a season in order for them to be allowed into the LMP's in the following season, so it's not really something you can just try once / for 1 season.

But I'm 99% sure I won't be running the future pCars Endurance leagues after this one, so it's maybe something you want to raise at the end of 'season review'. And whoever picks up the league for the future can look into that.