PC - Opinion Poll - Race Start Procedure | ApexOnlineRacing.com

PC Opinion Poll - Race Start Procedure


Which race start procedure do you prefer?


  • Total voters
    109
  • Poll closed .

Oblit0r

Formula 3 Test Driver
Jan 10, 2018
188
154
I think the ACC system is too harsh. Slightly going off line to the left or right can already result in a DT penalty.
I have no issues with DTs being handed out by the stewards because of bad behavior in previous races, but receiving a completely unjustified DT because of an automated system in my opinion is utter bullshit. I'm here to race, I think we all are. If I receive a DT, the possibility to race is taken away from me. I'm not here to hotlap for 60-90 minutes, knowing the end result will be **** anyway, there's no fun in that for me personally.

I think if this system will eventually replace the one we have in place, the /clear_all command should be used to clear all DTs handed out at the start of the race and after the race it should be investigated if someone indeed did something wrong that's worth penalizing and giving him a time penalty + getting a Q ban for next race (or something along the lines of that).
Like I said, I'm here to race. If I do something wrong during the formation lap, it will be a genuine mistake - not something worthy of a DT. I assume this will be the case for most people driving in this league. A DT removes the possibility to race, so I might aswell ALT+F4 out of the game.

I already read in discord that the /clear_all command won't be used, just wanted to express my feelings about it again hoping to make it clear why I think this. Maybe other people will reconsider voting for the ACC system aswell.
 

Ivarpoiss

Pro Karter
Jan 27, 2020
25
5
I'm in between. I like the automatic penalties and the randomized start. The HUD and collisions should be treated as assists.

Currently the AOR start is not used to it's potential. People mess up, nobody cares too much as long as the whole grid isn't wrecked. Like this incident where I would have penalised anyone but Jasper (Mainly #24, but iOigus and me aswell. In other words, looked at the drivers who cause a cascade like this).
 

Steve Allan

F1 Reserve Driver
May 12, 2019
505
316
I can see where you're coming from Oblitor, that's why in my original post I said it needs to be trialed first. I've raced eight times with the new system in ACC got 1 DT and was able to come back through the field, so I don't think it's a "Race killer" per say it just means the race will be a lot toughter to finish where you expect to finish. So yeah it's an added factor to the formation lap (Like getting heat and temps in breaks and tyres) which could go wrong, but then again it's a case of do you want drive throughs wrecking your race, or having someone yeet it into the back of your car and cause up to (for example) 15 minutes of repair time and wrecking your race?

Also, remember ACC and Kunos are always adapting, listening and changing things behind the scenes, While now it will seem too harsh a patch or two down the line they could either go too liniate with it or get it spot on.

Honestly the more I've thought about it, it's like the whole VAR discussion in Football at the moment, if we can trial it and get it working then it could be a good thing, if people jump too soon and rush it out cause "It's a new idea", it could end up getting a ton of pushback.
 

Oblit0r

Formula 3 Test Driver
Jan 10, 2018
188
154
To add a final word about what I said about the /clear_all option in my previous post, it seems you can see penalties in the replay screen so it would be very easy to check whether or not someone deserved a penalty for being out of position:
1582935205613.png


Now I'll give it a rest and I'll just have to live with whatever decision will be made in the end :p
 
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StephenCarry

AOR PC GT3 S14 T2 Champion
Staff member
PCARS Coordinator
Premium Member
Jun 13, 2019
690
426
Difficult.

I love the AOR start, as it's easy, competitive and spices things up. Don't like the widget start for unfair DTs and possible carnage which @Shooter80 already mentioned in his great summary.

BUT. Apparently A LOT of drivers mess up the AOR start, there's SOOO MUCH problems:

People crash while still on the formation lap
leaders don't go fast enough
drivers overtaking before the "real" start
drivers not driving in double file so they gain a huge advantage
drivers overtake the car in front of them before the finish line against the rules
drivers go whenever they seem fit - before the leader even goes for it
drivers "forgetting" their position and mess up the complete pack
T1 carnage


There are sooo many inquiries bcs people keep messing the easiest thing up...

So I go with others: Try the widget start in the next maybe 4 practice races for the next 2 real races and then see.
 
Last edited:
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Steve Allan

F1 Reserve Driver
May 12, 2019
505
316
Or there is another option, which won’t be poplar at all. Break the grid in sections and let them go at 10 second intervals. So say there is a 40 car grid. Top ten goes ahead for ten seconds advantage, 11 to 20 goes after that 21 to 30 etc you get the drift.
Sure it’ll put the people (like me) at a major disadvantage being close to 30 seconds off the lead, but it would give the league staff a chance to see how people treat and react to it, therefore keeping the AOR start, but (within theory) cutting down the amount of cars going at once and once again within theory reducing the carnage of the formation lap and T1
 

krop

ACC Coordinator
Staff member
ACC Coordinator
Jul 25, 2018
418
254
I have a couple of issues with the AOR start:
  • It's not realistic - no race series that I know of run such start, they usually go on green (like the real Blancpain GT) or do a standing start (F1, BTCC).
  • It's a bit anti-climatic to have the green flag drop and the crew chief yelling "go, go, go!" but the cars are going at a snail's pace. (That might be just me, though :whistle: )
  • There are a couple of technical issues with it - since it's done when the game thinks we are racing there are possible off-track issues we've discovered, plus it robs us of some race time, meaning the actual race lasts for about 56 minutes.
  • The AOR start is prone to creating what some people call the "harmonica effect" - which can catch people off guard once they get to turn 1. It's especially bad on tracks with a tight T1 (Monza, Zandvoort)
  • If someone misses the moment the preceding car accelerates people behind him can get screwed over, sometimes losing 3-4 positions before the pack reaches T1, especially on tracks which have a long S/F straight and the line is very far away from T1 (Catalunya, Nurburgring and Monza for example). It has happened before, it has happened to me a couple of times, which really puts me off.
  • After almost 3 seasons of ACC and over 15 seasons of Project Cars people still sometimes mess up the forming up phase, confusing things like which line they are supposed to take during the double-file phase. Punts happen, too, which is why I raised this topic among the staff members in the first place. Pro tier is yet to have a race this season where everything goes smoothly, I'm sorry to say :(
The in-game start:

The only issue I see is that if someone really screws up the procedure they might get a penalty, but otherwise I'd rather run something that the game already has instead of trying to reinvent the wheel. Otherwise, to me it ticks most of the boxes - it's built-in, the timer is frozen until the green flag drops and when it drops, the race starts - just like the real thing. I haven't seen these issues yet on the CP races, but other staff members are concerned which is why everything is still TBA - a patch or two might make it much better.

Or there is another option, which won’t be poplar at all. Break the grid in sections and let them go at 10 second intervals. So say there is a 40 car grid. Top ten goes ahead for ten seconds advantage, 11 to 20 goes after that 21 to 30 etc you get the drift.
Sure it’ll put the people (like me) at a major disadvantage being close to 30 seconds off the lead, but it would give the league staff a chance to see how people treat and react to it, therefore keeping the AOR start, but (within theory) cutting down the amount of cars going at once and once again within theory reducing the carnage of the formation lap and T1
I once ran in an ACC league which used a single-file start where we'd space out each other about 1.5 seconds apart and drive like that until we cross the S/F line where we'd be allowed to go full throttle. Needless to say, said league is also using the "widget" start now. It is a very safe way to start the race, but there's no excitement and no pack of cars rushing into T1.

Like I said, I don't think we should be trying to reinvent the wheel here. One big reason AOR start was introduced in the first place back in PC days was because the in-game procedure was completely broken, often crashing the cars before the race even began with no control from the driver.
 

VoodooChild

ACC Coordinator
Staff member
ACC Coordinator
Mar 27, 2018
1,574
1,133
My main concern about the widget start is the same one @M. Nobel expressed: NA cars and porsche in particular have an enormous advantage vs other cars, which often causes 4 or 5 wide situations at first corner with easy to guess results.

Other than that, I fail to comprehend why a widget start with ghosting cars would be more realistic than a manual AOR style start:geek:
 

Vanders

Formula 4 1st Driver
May 7, 2018
143
119
The in-games manual start would get my vote.

I confess I haven't tried the widget one (haven't done any CP races), but the potential for DTs is troubling. I am curious, though, how well does it handle disconnects? I've seen quite a few examples recently where people disconnect or forget to press Drive and everyone gets a bit confused about where they should be. Only takes one person to get it wrong and whole grid can be messed up.
 
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alfonsosvk

Semi-Pro Karter
Feb 27, 2020
16
7
The in-game start. Never had issues with it so far. But as someone said, it would be better if the start would be at 80 km/h and not 60, but that is not an issue for me
 

Legendacb

Formula 4 Reserve Driver
Dec 19, 2018
97
45
My main concern about the widget start is the same one @M. Nobel expressed: NA cars and porsche in particular have an enormous advantage vs other cars, which often causes 4 or 5 wide situations at first corner with easy to guess results.

Other than that, I fail to comprehend why a widget start with ghosting cars would be more realistic than a manual AOR style start:geek:
Faster acceleration??

Also GT3 its by definition a unbalance category as every car would have different strengths.